# dApp Staking V3 on Shiden **URL:** \ **Category:** Shiden Network (Kusama)\ **Created:** [February 15, 2024, 2:14pm UTC](https://forum.astar.network/t/dapp-staking-v3-on-shiden/6190 "2024-02-15T14:14:20Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 12\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![GuiGou](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex020/user_avatar/forum.astar.network/guigou/32/1366_2.png) [@GuiGou](https://forum.astar.network/u/GuiGou)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2024, 2:14pm UTC](https://forum.astar.network/t/dapp-staking-v3-on-shiden/6190/1 "2024-02-15T14:14:20Z")
Based on the developer rewards received in the first `Build&Earn` subperiod (14 SDN received for the tier 2, 5 SDN for the tier 3, 0.14 SDN for the tier 4), I have the feeling that the formulas used in dApp Staking V3 was designed with Astar in mind. But, it seems these formulas should be adjusted for Shiden. Specially the formula to dynamically compute the number of slot based on the ASTR/SDN price. ```auto number_of_slots = floor(1000∗ASTR USD + 50) on Astar Network number_of_slots = floor(1000∗SDN USD + 50) on Shiden Network ``` Because the circulating supply and maket cap on Shiden are much lower than Astar, and the SDN USD price is higher that ASTR USD price, the developers on Shiden received low rewards. It’s why I would like this formula will be updated for Shiden. For example: `number_of_slots = floor(100∗SDN USD + 50)` As another approach, we can also force the configuration via the `forceSetTierConfig` method. This approach could be used while waiting for the formula to be adapted for Shiden. ---
**Author:** ![Juminstock](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex020/user_avatar/forum.astar.network/juminstock/32/5942_2.png) [@Juminstock](https://forum.astar.network/u/Juminstock)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2024, 3:27pm UTC](https://forum.astar.network/t/dapp-staking-v3-on-shiden/6190/2 "2024-02-15T15:27:02Z")
This is a vital point to consider, mainly so that our stakers in Shiden do not feel that they should not be in that network and migrate to Astar. I support your proposal to make a correction to the rewards, GuiGou. ---
**Author:** ![Dino](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e95f7d/32.png) [@Dino](https://forum.astar.network/u/Dino)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2024, 5:04pm UTC](https://forum.astar.network/t/dapp-staking-v3-on-shiden/6190/3 "2024-02-15T17:04:29Z")
GuiGuo and me have discussed this of the forum, and I do agree it’s not the best situation. We should make Shiden more competitive. However, we also shouldn’t try to achieve the same numbers as we have on Astar. It’s simply not plausible. Astar has much higher value and utilization than Shiden, and that’s a fact. By implementing the proposed formula adjustment, we cut down on the number of dApp slots significantly. And if `SDN` were to fall down to e.g. 0.2$, there would only be 20 slots. I’ve created a [Github issue](https://github.com/AstarNetwork/Astar/issues/1177) to address this. ---
**Author:** ![bao](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex020/user_avatar/forum.astar.network/bao/32/1809_2.png) [@bao](https://forum.astar.network/u/bao)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2024, 11:58pm UTC](https://forum.astar.network/t/dapp-staking-v3-on-shiden/6190/4 "2024-02-15T23:58:31Z")
This is a very important discussion for Shiden. GuiGou, thank you for raising the issue and proposing solutions. Also, thank you, Dino, for creating the issue right away. I appreciate your prompt response. I also support this proposal. ---
**Author:** ![you425](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex020/user_avatar/forum.astar.network/you425/32/3313_2.png) [@you425](https://forum.astar.network/u/you425)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2024, 2:20am UTC](https://forum.astar.network/t/dapp-staking-v3-on-shiden/6190/5 "2024-02-16T02:20:34Z")
Thank you for your proposal. It is inappropriate to use the same formula for SDN and Astar because their situations are different. I fully support this proposal. ---
**Author:** ![naoyo4](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex020/user_avatar/forum.astar.network/naoyo4/32/970_2.png) [@naoyo4](https://forum.astar.network/u/naoyo4)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2024, 3:01am UTC](https://forum.astar.network/t/dapp-staking-v3-on-shiden/6190/6 "2024-02-16T03:01:53Z")
I fully agree with you. No one care about $SDN in forum discussion. I mentioned before. No plan on SDN. SDN is NOT DEAD, SDN is $DED. I also looking forward to $DED. 🥰 Get Lucky more rewards. 🍀 ---
**Author:** ![Dino](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e95f7d/32.png) [@Dino](https://forum.astar.network/u/Dino)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2024, 3:14pm UTC](https://forum.astar.network/t/dapp-staking-v3-on-shiden/6190/7 "2024-02-16T15:14:43Z")
For reference, the numbers would look like this with the proposed formula. ![Screenshot 2024-02-16 at 16.12.07](https://us1.discourse-cdn.com/flex020/uploads/plasmnet/original/2X/d/d53cf5b3a52a11983051361d125eaa24e3e2b1ab.png) ![Screenshot 2024-02-16 at 16.12.24](https://us1.discourse-cdn.com/flex020/uploads/plasmnet/original/2X/9/9c1c0ae02c4cb5f1a70d79cde2414c7cf51ab5d3.png) ---
**Author:** ![GuiGou](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex020/user_avatar/forum.astar.network/guigou/32/1366_2.png) [@GuiGou](https://forum.astar.network/u/GuiGou)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2024, 11:04am UTC](https://forum.astar.network/t/dapp-staking-v3-on-shiden/6190/8 "2024-02-17T11:04:32Z")
Thnaks @Dino to share these numbers. It looks better but there are not many dApps or developers on Shiden. The dApp Staking, the `Build To Earn` feature, should attract them to come to build on Shiden and then on Astar. It’s why I would prefer to have few available slots and seemly income for developers to see more dApps on Shiden. I suggest to use this forrmula `number_of_slots = floor(100∗SDN USD + 20)` ---
**Author:** ![Juminstock](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex020/user_avatar/forum.astar.network/juminstock/32/5942_2.png) [@Juminstock](https://forum.astar.network/u/Juminstock)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2024, 3:38pm UTC](https://forum.astar.network/t/dapp-staking-v3-on-shiden/6190/9 "2024-02-19T15:38:04Z")
I am in favor of this approach, if we channel the creation of applications first through shiden and then through Astar, we will be carrying out the flow proposed by Polkadot from the beginning. ---
**Author:** ![Dino](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e95f7d/32.png) [@Dino](https://forum.astar.network/u/Dino)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2024, 5:17pm UTC](https://forum.astar.network/t/dapp-staking-v3-on-shiden/6190/10 "2024-02-19T17:17:04Z")
The reality of situation is very different from what’s written here. Shiden si not a new network, it’s been live for well over 2 years. What Polkadot/Parity envisioned, and what is, differs. The suggested adjustment, where factor of `1000x` is reduced to `100x`, is already a huge decrease. Shiden is not used much. Every new developer that comes will prefer Astar over Shiden. With the new reward system, there isn’t even a way for someone to reap excessive reward amounts due to lack of stakers in the system, so there’s no argument that Shiden is “less competitive” than Astar. For comparison, here are rewards for `Astar`: ![Screenshot 2024-02-19 at 18.09.14](https://us1.discourse-cdn.com/flex020/uploads/plasmnet/original/2X/4/47ff441d2e402a2b970f82dd1ca6e50856afb279.png) Based on what I wrote here, there’s no reason to reduce slot numbers even further. The only benefit I see from this is for the few dApps that earn rewards there - it definitely won’t attract new devs there. ---
**Author:** ![GuiGou](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex020/user_avatar/forum.astar.network/guigou/32/1366_2.png) [@GuiGou](https://forum.astar.network/u/GuiGou)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2024, 10:24am UTC](https://forum.astar.network/t/dapp-staking-v3-on-shiden/6190/11 "2024-02-20T10:24:09Z")
To be honest, I think it will be difficult to attract/retain qualified developers with such low incomes. On Astar, reaching tier 3 is not easy (15M ASTR) and $300-$400 per month is insufficient to maintain an existing dApp or create a new one. In my opinion, these thresholds should be reviewed quickly. ---
**Author:** ![Dino](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e95f7d/32.png) [@Dino](https://forum.astar.network/u/Dino)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2024, 10:37am UTC](https://forum.astar.network/t/dapp-staking-v3-on-shiden/6190/12 "2024-02-20T10:37:39Z")
These are rewards, not income. And what developers need to do is attract stakers, they do not need to stake anything themselves. And I disagree with them being low - e.g. if a project ends up in tier 3, which isn’t very difficult, they’re looking at an additional ~50k$ revenue per year, which is by no means small amount. Grants are given out for much much less. Please also keep in mind that one of the goals with v3 was/is to prevent dApps from earning huge amounts of rewards. The thresholds were reviewed thoroughly prior to the launch (Astar), and there’s no plan to review them until some time has passed, and we have data to analyze. Staked amount needs to be high, and everyone needs to work on attracting active stakers.