# dApps Staking v3 - proposal **URL:** \ **Category:** General\ **Created:** [January 2, 2023, 2:09pm UTC](https://forum.astar.network/t/dapps-staking-v3-proposal/4206 "2023-01-02T14:09:40Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 1\ **Showing post:** 108
**Author:** ![you425](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex020/user_avatar/forum.astar.network/you425/32/3313_2.png) [@you425](https://forum.astar.network/u/you425)\ **Post date:** [February 29, 2024, 6:11am UTC](https://forum.astar.network/t/dapps-staking-v3-proposal/4206/108 "2024-02-29T06:11:39Z")
Thank you for taking time out of your busy schedule to comment as the launch of zkEVM approaches. I also have nothing but respect for you and your core team leading the development. > [@Dino](#): > > ### Tier System > > From all the discussions I can see, everything seems to be working as intended. > Tier system was explained over a year ago, so calling it absurd or nonsensical is “absurd” in itself. Yes, this is absolutely true - it was proposed over a year ago, and no one opposed it at the time, and neither did I. However, the parameters were not finalized as of a year ago, and the specific parameters did not come out with the report until last August. > [@Astar Tokenomics 2.0: A Dynamically Adjusted Inflation](https://forum.astar.network/t/astar-tokenomics-2-0-a-dynamically-adjusted-inflation/4924): > > Table of contents [Introduction](https://forum.astar.network/t/astar-tokenomics-2-0-a-dynamically-adjusted-inflation/4924#introduction-1)[Current Tokenomics Overview](https://forum.astar.network/t/astar-tokenomics-2-0-a-dynamically-adjusted-inflation/4924#current-tokenomics-overview-2) – [Block Rewards](https://forum.astar.network/t/astar-tokenomics-2-0-a-dynamically-adjusted-inflation/4924#block-rewards-3) – [Transaction Fees](https://forum.astar.network/t/astar-tokenomics-2-0-a-dynamically-adjusted-inflation/4924#transaction-fees-4) — [Native Fees](https://forum.astar.network/t/astar-tokenomics-2-0-a-dynamically-adjusted-inflation/4924#native-fees-5) — [Ethereum Fees](https://forum.astar.network/t/astar-tokenomics-2-0-a-dynamically-adjusted-inflation/4924#ethereum-fees-6) – [Rent Fees](https://forum.astar.network/t/astar-tokenomics-2-0-a-dynamically-adjusted-inflation/4924#rent-fees-7)[Problems We Like To Address](https://forum.astar.network/t/astar-tokenomics-2-0-a-dynamically-adjusted-inflation/4924#problems-we-would-like-to-address-8) – [High & Fixed Inflation](https://forum.astar.network/t/astar-tokenomics-2-0-a-dynamically-adjusted-inflation/4924#high-fixed-inflation-9) – [Scalable & Inclusive dApp Staking](https://forum.astar.network/t/astar-tokenomics-2-0-a-dynamically-adjusted-inflation/4924#scalable-inclusive-dapp-staking-10) – [Native & Ethereum Fee Alignment](https://forum.astar.network/t/astar-tokenomics-2-0-a-dynamically-adjusted-inflation/4924#native-ethereum-fee-alignment-11) – [High Treasury & Collator Rewards](https://forum.astar.network/t/astar-tokenomics-2-0-a-dynamically-adjusted-inflation/4924#high-treasury-collator-rewards-12) – [Materials](https://forum.astar.network/t/astar-tokenomics-2-0-a-dynamically-adjusted-inflation/4924#materials-13)[Proposed Solution](https://forum.astar.network/t/astar-tokenomics-2-0-a-dynamically-adjusted-inflation/4924#proposed-solution-14) – [Inflation](https://forum.astar.network/t/astar-tokenomics-2-0-a-dynamically-adjusted-inflation/4924#inflation-15) – [Treasury](https://forum.astar.network/t/astar-tokenomics-2-0-a-dynamically-adjusted-inflation/4924#treasury-16) – [Collators](https://forum.astar.network/t/astar-tokenomics-2-0-a-dynamically-adjusted-inflation/4924#collators-17) – [dApp Staking](https://forum.astar.network/t/astar-tokenomics-2-0-a-dynamically-adjusted-inflation/4924#dapp-staking-18) — [Stakers](https://forum.astar.network/t/astar-tokenomics-2-0-a-dynamically-adjusted-inflation/4924#stakers-19) — [Builders](https://forum.astar.network/t/astar-tokenomics-2-0-a-dynamically-adjusted-inflation/4924#builders-20) – [Transaction Fees](https://forum.astar.network/t/astar-tokenomics-2-0-a-dynamically-adjusted-inflation/4924#transaction-fees-21) – [Rent Fees](https://forum.astar.network/t/astar-tokenomics-2-0-a-dynamically-adjusted-inflation/4924#rent-fees-22)[Summary](https://forum.astar.network/t/astar-tokenomics-2-0-a-dynamically-adjusted-inflation/4924#summary-23)[Materials](https://forum.astar.network/t/astar-tokenomics-2-0-a-dynamically-adjusted-inflation/4924#materials-24)[Next Steps](https://forum.astar.network/t/astar-tokenomics-2-0-a-dynamically-adjusted-inflation/4924#next-steps-25)Introduction Hello everyo… We then looked at the parameters at this time and determined that there was no problem. ![image](https://us1.discourse-cdn.com/flex020/uploads/plasmnet/original/2X/a/a6ff7b18d0851ae4c6ee820a831eafd860639161.png) However, the parameters were changed this month (of course, I don’t think it’s strange that changes are being made). > [@Astar Tokenomics 2.0: A Dynamically Adjusted Inflation](https://forum.astar.network/t/astar-tokenomics-2-0-a-dynamically-adjusted-inflation/4924/32): > > Hello everyone, the PR with dApp staking v3 & Tokenomics 2.0 params for Shiden & Astar is [here](https://github.com/AstarNetwork/astar-docs/pull/595), under review. To avoid repeating same information again, I will just focus on short overview of why some parameters were chosen. In general, we followed suggestions from the report, but adjusted some parts to better suit on-chain logic, and the architecture we wanted to have. Eras, subperiods, periods, cycles 3 periods per cycle for Astar to avoid making the process to repetitive stakers need to… Or is it at the time of this posting? > [@dApps Staking v3 - proposal](https://forum.astar.network/t/dapps-staking-v3-proposal/4206/56): > > As everyone probably already knows, Astar launch is planed for next Monday, 12.2.2024. Some things have changed according to the initial proposal, but it has all been shared, documented & communicated. Astar docs are the best resource if anyone’s interested in dApp staking v3 & Tokenomics 2.0 deep dive. Essentially, all of the features that were initially planned have been implemented. With one exception - automatic price detection, or the oracle solution. This is also tied to more frequent … I am ashamed to admit that I only noticed this significant parameter change when I checked the documentation in this post. This is just before v3 is completed implementation in Astar. > [@dApps Staking v3 - proposal](https://forum.astar.network/t/dapps-staking-v3-proposal/4206/62): > > Just to emphasize - in my post I said nothing about shortening the period duration. That’s not on the table - and why would it be? We’re literally launching tomorrow and haven’t seen how it will work with the current parameters. Doesn’t make sense that I would make a post that we’re considering changing existing params while we still haven’t even launched yet. My post was about how often tier configuration recalculation is done. Tokenomics has changed a lot with this parameter change, and while it is understandable that it was hastily adjusted to coincide with the launch of zkEVM, I think this is too much of an explanation. One wonders how many community members were able to see the changes. The way the change was made, it was felt that it was made even more difficult to recognize, since detailed numbers had been provided in the past. This change changes Extra Rewards to Bonus Rewards and also changes the mechanism itself. There were no postings where we could read this information, and we had to read the documentation to grasp it. Tokenomics 2.0 is explained to the public in blogs as well as reports. [https://astar.network/blog/astar-tokenomics-2.0:-driving-long-term-success-and-39068](https://astar.network/blog/astar-tokenomics-2.0:-driving-long-term-success-and-39068) However, there is no explanation of this change. Therefore, I hastily prepared an explanatory article for the community. (I had been waiting for Astar to make an official announcement because I was aware that the previous parameters were only temporary.) > **[Astar Tokenomics 2.0 & dApp Staking v3 Update｜you425](https://note.com/you425/n/n7b8ca6ab0c46)** > > こんにちは、noteではお久しぶりです。 ついに昨日の夕方、AstarのdApp Staking v3がリリースされました🎉 🎉 Today is the day, dApp Staking v3 is officially live on Astar Network! Remember, stakers, your tokens are unstaked but locked. Make sure to stake them again on your favorite dApps... **Change of Allocation** ![image](https://us1.discourse-cdn.com/flex020/uploads/plasmnet/original/2X/2/2f15fbb7cd1cbb868e2f54634334451bc31ff0a2.png) And this has resulted in a significant change in compensation, especially for dApps. I am posting the image again to make it cheaper to compare. **August 2023** ![image](https://us1.discourse-cdn.com/flex020/uploads/plasmnet/original/2X/a/a6ff7b18d0851ae4c6ee820a831eafd860639161.png) **Current** (Thank you, Dino) ![image](https://us1.discourse-cdn.com/flex020/uploads/plasmnet/original/2X/1/1fb364e9abf10f138210e1608a3a71c0c2e1c1fd.png) Rewards were reduced across the board, most notably in Tier 4. - TIer1: -33% - Tier2: -17% - Tier3: -33% - Tier4: -86% > [@Dino](#): > > ### Rewards & Price > > I’ve commented it [here](https://forum.astar.network/t/age-of-chronos-dapp-staking-proposal/5176/74), but to repeat, **ASTR** price has increased roughly 3-4x in the last 4 months. The amount of rewards received by the developers has also increased by the same factor - however, this hasn’t been mentioned once in the discussion so far. Yes, I think this is correct. And I don’t think it is strange that this would result in a modification to the parameters presented in August. But this was too extreme. And I didn’t feel there was any room for discussion about this change. If there had been room for discussion, I would have suggested creating a middle ground between Tier 3 and Tier 4 (i.e., increasing the number of tiers). > [@Dino](#): > > Tier 4 rewards are meant to be entry level, they are supposed to be meager. > Tier 3 rewards are meant to be much more substantial. I agree with this, but I am not sure how much ASTR should be collected to be no longer at the introductory level. And I don’t think there is a right answer to this. > [@Dino](#): > > For a well established project, with a solid (and loyal) user base, achieving tier 3 (or 2) should not pose a significant challenge. Yes, I believe that is true. However, the more a project needs help from dApp Staking, the more difficult it should be to earn a user base in its initial state. I recognize dApp Staking as a system that gives developers a kind of basic income to make it easier for them to focus on development. However, I am not sure of the value of its existence when disparities like this one occur. Of course, even in this situation, I think it has a great effect compared to blockchain, which gives a portion of the gas money back to the smart contract deployer. However, I feel this is a bit different from the significance I felt for dApp Staking (maybe it’s just me). > [@Dino](#): > > It’s not clear to me how would you define total number of dApps that the protocol can support? This is very important, since based on this proposal, dApps are almost always in between the the starting & ending point of the line. > > The system should not"punish" `dApp A` when `dApp B` increases its stake amount. I don’t see how you can achieve this without extremely reducing the amount of dApps that protocol can support. Thank you for your words of praise! However, I did not understand the meaning of this comment. It may be a matter of your perception due to my lack of explanation. In my proposed model, the maximum reward for each Tier is determined based on the number of slots allocated. Therefore, an increase in stake in any of the dApps will not affect the other dApps. In other words, there is no competition for market share as in v2. This is one of the key features of the hybrid model. In order to get the full amount of rewards allocated to each Tier slot, the ASTR must be staked up to the limit. The other parts I did not specifically comment on are the parts I basically agree with. I salute you. Thanks in advance for your implementation of the Tier recalculation and the oracle thing. Thanks again. I also appreciate the ongoing efforts to adjust parameters and logic based on observations. However, I think it is undeniable that some aspects of this case were caused by a lack of information sharing (not your fault, but the Foundation’s problem as a whole). On that basis, I have proposed this hybrid model, which I believe can be improved in a way that is as close as possible to the intent of this parameter change. I am not proposing this based on content that came out over a year ago, I am proposing it based on what was implemented this month and the reaction to it. Nevertheless, of course, if this is adopted, it would be a major change and would be expensive to develop. Therefore, I would be fine with it if it is acceptable to the community (including developers), including a temporary solution. --- _[View the full topic](https://forum.astar.network/t/dapps-staking-v3-proposal/4206)._