I have great respect for the work and everything that Sota and his team do, but in light of recent events, I have some significant differences. As for vesting for ETH blocking participants, I propose to bring this issue to public discussion and hold a popular referendum, because neither I nor my friends agree with these conditions. As far as I have noticed, many other participants in this blocking also disagree with this. Of course, I have nothing against those guys who participate in receiving awards for crowdloans, but why all of a sudden, a whole year after the block, I, as one of those who believed in the project in its very bud, have to accept these unfavorable conditions for me? In the end, if I’m not mistaken, thanks to Dapp-Stacking, about 10 million (with the existing issue) new Astar tokens will be brought to the market every week, which are not subject to any vesting. It’s not fair.
You are trying to change all the principles of “fair and equitable distribution”, which you have been talking about so hard and firmly throughout your work, so what has changed? Have you broken down under the yoke of haters, for whom the most important thing here is to earn? Then why didn’t you hold a sale, following the example of Akala or Moonbeam? Why then did I block my ETH for 3 whole years? In general, the community still has a lot of questions, so I think that this should be discussed not in a narrow circle of developers, but with the community and the decision should be made directly through a REFERENDUM. Thanks.
There is vesting for the ETH Lockdrop reward tokens?
Offer your ideas, guys. Everything should happen honestly and fairly, for everyone.
I propose the following voting options:
1.Blocking and gradual distribution of rewards to application developers for Dapp-stacking (Vesting) Their rewards can greatly influence the price of the coin. We see this in the example of SDN.
2. Cancellation of blocking and return of blocked ETH coins, with the full preservation of the received Astar coins.
3. Distribution of alternative liquid ETH tokens to the participants of the Lockdrop, for the time of blocking (For example, BETH or BDOT)
4. Cancel the idea of vesting for Lockdrop participants
In any case, the blocked coins, at least most of them, must be received before the bull market ends.
As a lockdrop participant I am strongly against vesting period for several reasons:
- There is no such condition 1.5 years ago and change a rules during the game is a bad practise.
- Reward during the lockdrop had been calculated without vesting. Otherwise, it would have been much higher.
So there are 2 ways:
- No vesting
- Additional bonuses/tokens for the lockdrop participants to compensate this vesting.
As an old Plasm/Astar fan, I am planning to take part in the Astar crowdloan but if the team set this vesting I will change my plan. I am not ready for another vesting, sorry.
I also lockdrop participant and I see positive effect on the network and ASTR price if tokens received as part of the lockdrop will have vesting.
What I want to suggest:
- Team should provide details about lockdrop tokens vesting now, this is needed for crowdloan reward metrics and this should boost crowdloan company.
- Vesting should not be long, I propose 20-30% unlocked after network is launched and then linear vesting for 2-4 months. During this period ASTR price should stabilize.
- dApp operators should also have reward lock at least until they fully run their functionalities on Astar network. What I see now on Shiden that there are some dApps and these dApps recieve rewards but in reality their product not fully operational on Shiden.
Where write about ASTR lockdrop will have vesting?
I would like to comment this important topic. People who participated in lockdrop did this action with some conditions, after changing whole project to Aster, they did not have a way how vote for new changes.
Now you changing game game and they cant to vote at all, this situation is really unfair for your true supporters…
I am categorically against this dubious idea.
First, why should I share my benefits with those who came to the project much later than me? I participated in the blocking a year and a half ago and at that time the conditions were completely different.
Secondly, why do I find out about plans to change everything from some guy in a Telegram, and not from the management, and this happens just before the launch itself?
I believe that the list of options should include the following:
- I categorically refuse from vesting.
- I agree, but on condition of a full refund of ETH this very minute.
- I agree, but on condition that all lockdrop participants are provided with additional substantial bonuses and benefits. With a reduction in the blocking time of ETH coins.
Once again, I am against this idea, categorically. I also can’t disagree with the author of this post about awards to application developers, if at the moment in the Shiden project this amounts to an additional 100k coins every week, then in Astar we will see a similar picture, but a few zeros more. Which will negatively affect the asset price and, accordingly, our investments. In the case of vesting.
I also think this is not fair to the participants in the lockdrop !!! I fully agree with the author of this message! need to arrange a referendum on this issue, I think the majority will be against! You cannot change the conditions of the find just before the start! Why didn’t you tell about it at once? I also locked all my Ethereum for 3 years !! I am against vesting!
Thank you for your comment. Since your ETH is locked on a smart contract deployed by the core team. But the smart contract is a contract deployed on Ethereum. It is technically impossible for all people to change the code. Therefore, vesting ETH is impossible.
Thanks a lot for your feedback. We haven’t decided on this for ETH lockdrop tokens about vesting. We only announced vesting for Crowdloan participants at this point. We are thinking about doing vesting but nothing is set in stone. Thanks for creating this topic! We would love to hear from the community.
Before answering your questions, I have the following things to add why vesting is important:
- 30% of Astar is from lockdrop, this is a huge amount to just unleash on the market. We did this for Shiden and saw a lot of selling pressure on the market because of this.
- 30% from lockdrop will not make us win that parachain. Those who join crowdloan makes us a parachain. Hope we can count on you joining?
- Lockdrop participants got SDN airdropped, meaning they already receive no vesting for another token with economic value.
- Lockdrop participants are a huge asset to our ecosystem and hope that they really support us by making this the best smart contract parachain.
Let me answer your proposed suggestions:
This is in our roadmap to do. Not having vesting but unbond period meaning that everything is on-chain when a project would call for an unbond so they can inform the community what they will do with the funds.
This is impossible to do. ETH from lockdrop is locked in a smart contract, we cant control this. It was part of the audit and asked by the community before we started the lockdrops.
Because we have no control over the smart contract we cant take your ETH, meaning we cant offer a liquid ETH. If we do, you would still be possible to unlock your ETH after locking period.
Let’s talk about this here or we can create a Zoom call for everyone who is interested to talk about this issue.
I really don’t like your last line: “do this before the bull market ends”. This means that you are only looking to sell at fast you can. You should be happy your ETH is still locked or you most likely would already sold it. It’s now already +10x since you locked.
Just to give a response to your question about additional bonuses/tokens for the lockdrop partipants:
- We gave you Shiden, meaning you got additional tokens on your lockdrop
- We give a 10% bonus for lockdrop participants if they join our crowdloan on Polkadot. We do need you guys in the crowdloan that’s why we offer an extra 10% bonus.
Thanks a lot for your feedback. Great that you see the power of vesting!
Our main focus is now winning a slot on Polkadot, this is one of the reasons we haven’t set vesting for lockdrop participants in stone. We thought we would boost with adding the 10% bonus for early supporters.
Vesting for 2-4 months is very short for 30% of the token supply. Having a larger unlocked supply is something that we have on the table. If you want to take it fair, you can look at it like this:
- Crowdloan have 22 months vesting
- Lockdrop already had 12 months locking
- Correct, see my reply above about this issue. It’s on our roadmap.
I disagree on your comment.
We are talking about this fully transparent and with respect to our lockdrop participants.
Thanks for your feedback.
I would like to invite you as well to talk about this referendum:
Let’s talk about this here or we can create a Zoom call for everyone who is interested to talk about this issue.
Thank you for your comment here @Maarten. All decisions should be made on the premise of long-term value maximization, not the pursuit of short-term profits. So it does not matter if it is a bull market or bear market as you say.
Therefore, people who would like to change the existing conditions have to mention the long-term ecosystem benefits to do a off-chain voting.
Thanks for your reply. About point 1, want to share my thoughts:
Some people doubt participate in Astar crowdloan because they think that 30% lockdrop tokens can significantly decrease their return as this amount can dump ASTR price.
As you said main focus is now winning a slot, that’s why I think If team announce lockdrop vesting before auction starts, it will help win a slot, most of people remove their doubts and invest into crowdloan, because after announcement they will know that lockdrop participants can’t right away sell their tokens.
Many lockdrop participants will not like this idea, but many who cares about project future support this also. We can stake our vested token and receive even more in time. As it was mentioned before we already won that we didn’t sell ETH and now it’s more then 10x in price. I think we will also win that we can’t sell ASTR right away after listing (at least some vesting part).
There is no doubt that many lockdrop participants have sold their SDN, instead of using the SDN as a utility tokens. This has created a negative impact on the price trend.
This act of dumping discourages people from participating in the Astar crowdloan, and if we do not win the Polkadot slot, the ASTR we have, do not have any value.
Therefore, we need to find a balance. People are free to sell and buy but dumping all your SDN for a quick penny doesnt do good to the ecosystem.
Therefore, I propose, whichever wallet that is holding PLM but have dumped >25% of their SDN, will have their PLM vested. Those who didn’t dump will not be imposed with vesting schedule.
So if you want your PLM not vested, you better buy back the SDN and use it for dapp staking.
absolutely fair !!! I participated lockdrop ETH and crowndlon on Kusama. Shiden and Astar are one. I fully agree with the proposal, only no more than 10%. Interesting offer please pay attention @sota
What Moonme (tiger) mentioned it is true.
The team should check those lockdrop and see who has sold 25% or transfer out 25% to exchange. And give them some vesting…
But this must be handle properly. As with this change. It will seem the team has going back on their words
Not sure is it possible… might need to take a voting with those lockdrop ppl.
Cos if they are unhappy… they will fud all the way, and reputation can be at stake.